Restore original flag system

[Tartiflette]

Hello, i like the flag system included in the mod, but its much random and i would maybe like to restore original system: one flag for ship and fort per nations.

How can i restore this ? delete modules, rewrite some lines in INI files ?

Thanks for your answer

• This topic was modified 9 years, 10 months ago by Tartiflette.

[modernknight1]

I wondered when someone would might say something about the flags. I thought it would be about changing them however – not that they are too random. People have complemented me a lot because most people like the new flags.

Funny enough I am working on an article about the flags of the Golden Age and GOF ERAS that will be published on the reef soon.

I will give a little preview here:

I start by explaining that I was trying to recreate the flags that you see in the classic sailing ship paintings of the 17th century.

All the flags by nation are correct for that time. So the flags that you see are as follows.

ENGLAND:
1. The classic red ensign with the cross of Saint George quartered in the upper corner.
2. The white cross of Saint George flag
3. The Guinea Company/English West India Company flag. Red and white stripes with the cross of Saint George in the upper corner.
4. The pre-1714 English union jack
5. Solid red battle flag, signal flag or Admiral’s flag

HOLLAND/United Provinces:
1. The Dutch Tricolor
2. The Double-Prinz or Double-Tri
3. The Lion of Nassau
4. The European Merchants Trading flag (red and white stripes)
5. Dutch West India Company (WIC) flag
6. Solid red battle flag, signal flag or Admiral’s flag

FRANCE:
1. The Royal French Naval Flag (white field with fluer de lis with the French royal arms of blue shield & 3 fleurs w flanking angels.
2. The French Naval Ensign (blue flag with multiple fluer de lis)
3. The French Royal Naval Jack (blue flag with three fluer de lis)
4. The French Flag (white flag with multiple fluer de lis)
5. The flag of the French Marchande Marine (white cross on blue field with French arms centered)
6. Solid red battle flag, signal flag or Admiral’s flag

SPAIN:
1. Royal Spanish Flag (Red Cross of Burgundy on white field with Spanish arms centered and quartered at the ends of the cross)
2. Royal Spanish Naval flag (Spanish Coat of Arms centered on a white field)
3. Spanish Naval Flag (Red Cross of Burgundy on a white field)
4. Catholic Virgin Saint Mary Red Battle flag
5. Spanish Merchant Trading flag (White cross of Burgundy on blue field)
6. Solid red battle flag, signal flag or Admiral’s flag

Pirates:
The Jolly Roger proper(skull and crossbones) did not exist yet in the 17th century with the exception of descriptions of Emanuel Wynne’s flag with the hourglass below in either 1699 or 1700.
1. Solid black flag
2. Solid dark red flag
3. Bloedvlag (Crimson flag with arm and Scimitar)
4. Winged Hourglass flag
5. Gravestone flag (skull with wings and hourglass on head)
6. Emmanuel Wynne flag

NOTE: Red flags are seen throughout the classic contemporary 17th century paintings off all factions. They have many different meanings which I will explain in the upcoming article. From “no quarter” to simply being the Squadron Commander or Admirals flags. You can have two with one being a signal to other ships. I will explain the signal meaning in the article.

NOTE: The European Merchant flag with the red and white stripes was universal to all nations that were trading. Especially in the East and West Indies. I gave this only to the Dutch because they most commonly used it and possessed the majority of the worlds trading vessels. Example: In 1650 Holland had 2500 merchant vessels while her closest competitor England only had about 180. The English developed their own version with Saint George’s cross in the upper corner. In addition both France and Spain have their own specific trading flags.

I realize that the order these flags appear on the masts are random, but they are correct for each nation.

I am working on a new version of the Flags that I hope to have in the patch. I have been able to modify the source dll file to accept new classe/types of flags. So by adding a new classification of flag, I can take my current ships init file that defines each ship type as “merchant” or “war” and then make it select flags that are only used by merchant ships OR war ships. This way you will never see the merchant flags appear on war ships (although I HAVE actually seen them on warships in paintings that are engaged with trading or escorting traders). I thought this might make it a little less random.

I am also trying to find a way so that the red battle flag will only come up as random for YOUR ship only and not the ones following. The code assigns a “leader” ship for each convoy you run into so if I’m successful that one would have the red battle flag(Admiral flag)

Of course I am still working on the white flag appearing when ships surrender.

I had thought of offering a mod that would only offer two flags per nationality eliminating the merchant flags. If people express an interest in that kind of mod here I will offer that. If they don’t I won’t.

Last I will honor your request – BUT not in the way you desire.

I will build a new texture file for GOF ERAS that only allows one flag to be used per nation. It will simply entail that you replace the existing texture file with the new one I provide.

The reason that I will not reveal the specifics on this is because I consider it my secret.

There are reasons for this. I tried to get others to help me with so many improvements/enhancements in ERAS. These people already knew how to do the things I wanted help with. Some of these people purposely withheld the help and files and models, etc. Only with the help of other friends was I able to get some of these things I wanted.

With some of the other enhancements, I had to spend hundreds of hours figuring it out myself how to do these things, when they could have saved me from wasting all that precious time. I did in the end figure it all out myself anyway.

So if I tell you how to do this, they will find out my secret quickly also and I know they want it. I hope they do figure it out, but they can spend a hundred hours experimenting just like I did.

I am always willing to open new dialogue with these people and even willing to trade things.

I may change my mind on this in the future depending on how things go.

MK

[Tartiflette]

Hello, thanks for your answer and sorry if you took it wrong, my english is not super good.

I didn’t wanted to say that the flags “look” random, but that their ingame assignment is random, for exemple, each time i go in and out of a building in city, flags on governor house change, same with fort, instead of have only english flag (for exemple) there will be ships ensign too on building..
A system like in PoTC mod would be maybe more appropriate, with assignment for each stuff: Fort & builidng specific flag, military ship specific flag, and merchant specific flag.
That what i said i would maybe like to restore original flag system for now insteas of random assignment.

I know you made just historical flag and that great. I noticed only some mistakes like the spanish ensign with coat of arms is the one under Bourbon crown and not Habsbourg. And east india company flag for england tough we are in west india in the game, but that is detail. Its a good work 🙂

[modernknight1]

Ah, I see. OK I understand.

Yes I cannot make them separate for forts or governors mansions. Perhaps in the future I can figure out how to separate them. If my merchant flag mod works than I can assign a new land based set of flags, but I don’t know how to assign them to just buildings yet. I will have hunt down some code where I could apply such instructions for the buildings. I’m certain its there, I just need to find it. That often takes time.

Good catch on the Bourbon flag. I love it when a historically minded person joins us and brings up these kinds of details!

However, 1701-1725 is within the time period of my mod so while its inappropriate for the 17th century, I put it in anyway. I am thinking about replacing it with another flag. Finding high resolution images is always a challenge. They MUST be VERY high resolution because the game does not render flag details that well.

Actually the English Guinea company flag WAS used in the Caribbean as well during this time. I have verified that. In fact the US flag can actually trace its origins to that very flag.

I am willing to look at any alternate recommendations for alternative replacements and I am glad that you are so interested!

MK

[Tartiflette]

Good to see you understand my wonderful english 😛

Maybe for your flag mods you could see how that kind of mod has been made in PotC, if coding architecture is same, maybe there is answer in it.

Glad that you didnt took bad my words on the spanish and other flags, i know your mod cover a large era so it is not unhistorical neither. And i didnt knew that about the English Guinea company, interresting. Flags and ensign is an interessting “science” ^^ The US flag doesn’t came symply from the 13th colonies ?

About alternate recommendations i dont have any, maybe one, replacing the french flag with “fleur de lys” and “coat of arms” with a full white flag, the “fleur de lys” and “coat of arms” version was only when there was a royal presence. Most used flag in military navy was the full white flag. And if i remember it was also used on building.

[Craig Brown]

I love the flags but it would be nice to have them be more consistent. However, I rather have the new verity then change it back to the boring way it was!

[Craig Brown]

Don’t let this mod go away.

[Author]

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